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| Price of rail | ||||
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| 20:18, 20 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Markdvdman Member Send a message Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 192 |
Hi guys, A mate asked me if train was cheap enough from Preston to London return for 2 people on October 10th returning on the 11th. It is basically £140 return on the railway albeit a quick 2hr 15min journey. However, megabus.com does it at £36 for the two of them. I know it is around 2.5 hrs longer in one direction on coach but can they justify (and this is a well advanced fair) nigh on 4 times the price? If it was £70 then it would be a fair price but 2.5 times slower and 4 times the price is a joke. Is this now proof that we need to go back into public ownership? Privatisation has so many people needing payments it is no wonder it is so damned expensive! | |||
| 21:02, 20 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Paul Scott Member Send a message Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 2375 |
Same dates you mention you can do the jouney by rail at £37.50 a head using Advance fares. Which is the correct comparison, because Megabus is not a walk up fare either. You seem to have fallen into the same trap as most newspaper comparisons... Paul | |||
| 21:12, 20 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Markdvdman Member Send a message Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 192 |
I do not know WHAT site you are using but I have looked at arriva and virgin and go through it as I cannot see where you are getting that price for RETURN. On virgin it looks like £70 but click there and back and it turns into £140.80! | |||
| 21:19, 20 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Markdvdman Member Send a message Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 192 |
Paul I never mentioned walk on fares - I was referring to advanced fares. Where did you find £37.50 a head return? I bet it is for one person! I made that mistake earlier - select two and it is nowhere near that it is a shade over £140! I am no fool to listen to newspaper crap. I got me and my mates a single to Twickenham when Iron Maiden were playing for £21 a head. I know how to book in advance! | |||
| 21:37, 20 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Class 87 Member 
Send a message Joined: Feb 2005 Posts: 1245 |
True, this is a shining example of what privatisation has brought to the railways, or the country's lack of support for trains. They privatise it to create competitive operators and proffit for the railways yet VT have competitipn rights and are pratcially a monopoly. Number of edits: 1. Last edit: 21:40, 20 September 2009 | |||
| 21:51, 20 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Class 170 Member Send a message Joined: Jan 2005 Posts: 4222 News credits: 1 |
For the following example of train fares from Preston to London on 10 October and London to Preston on 11 October on Nationalrail.co.uk An Open return that you can buy on the day is indeed about £140 However if you buy an advance fare it is cheaper like so Preston to London Euston Saturday 10 October Depart 15:58 Preston arrive London 18:12 £25 single fare each so total of £50 for two people London Euston to Preston Sunday 11 October Depart 20:25 London arrive Preston 22:58 £25 single fare each so total of £50 for two people Total cost of return trip is £100. However you must travel on those trains stated on your ticket no exceptions. Note the Data provided above is correct as of 21:50 20/09/2009 and is clearly subject to change as people purchase the fares as there are only so many of them. These are all personal opinions | |||
| 22:00, 20 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Markdvdman Member Send a message Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 192 |
Yes but the 9am or so train from Preston and the 11am train back is subject to the maximum fair. It is massively constrained to even get the £100 fair! Very bad indeed! | |||
| 23:00, 20 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Mark B! Member Send a message Joined: Apr 2006 Posts: 1229 News credits: 1 |
Could it be that the cheap tickets have sold out for that early service. I found tickets are more expensive heading into London in the mornings because those trains are popular with day trippers, so the cheap advance deals sell out. Look later in the day and there are loads. A bunch from work are going to London to see some football match from Exeter. £60 return for all 3! They are traveling up late morning, and coming back early the following day (either Hotel or go clubbing and hang around till 8am) | |||
| 09:36, 21 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Paul Scott Member Send a message Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 2375 |
National Rail Enquiries. £25.00 Advance for an up train on 10th, £12.50 Advance for down train on 11th. Time dependent though, same as Megabus. Paul Number of edits: 2. Last edit: 09:42, 21 September 2009 | |||
| 09:41, 21 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Paul Scott Member Send a message Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 2375 |
Yup you're right - £37.50 a head(what I said)usually means one person... Paul | |||
| 22:38, 21 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Markdvdman Member Send a message Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 192 |
Paul - the problem is time dependancy! It is dreadful. Saturdays are not peak times (well football and rugby can change that I agree). The times you are talking are heavily constrained, and costs you time out on your destination. It is not good at all and overcomplicated. You will NOT get £37.50 a head, leaving at approx 9am, and coming back on at 11ish Sunday morning. I hope you prove me wrong as I will bow to your wisdom and ALWAYS ask for help in such situations in future!  | |||
| 12:30, 22 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Paul Scott Member Send a message Joined: Jan 2007 Posts: 2375 |
Then you should make it clear that your particular journey has time constraints. You basically start off by saying 'the cheapest rail fare is £70 per head'. This is not correct, unless you point out your time restrictions. Paul | |||
| 22:42, 22 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Markdvdman Member Send a message Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 192 |
Paul all I am saying the standard advance rate is a total rip off!! what if I was a football fan travelling from the north to London on a saturday to watch a 3pm game? The cheap rate then is unavailable. I am making a general point and the cheap rates are stifling in fact bordering on useless for most people! I did not stipulate time - I am generalising on how pathetic and constrained it is! | |||
| 12:31, 23 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Bedpan Member 
Send a message Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 685 |
I agree, advance is a total rip off!!! This year I have so far had to pay the extortionate sums of £1 return Milton Keynes to Glasgow, £18 return Stevenage to Inverness, £8 single Hemel Hempstead to Smethwick, £15 return (if I recall correctly) Stevenage to Newcastle and Stevenage to Durham. Most of these were day trips, with several hours (typicalli 8 or 9) at the destination; the Inverness one was on the Highland Chieftain both directions. Visit http://bedpan.fotopic.net. | |||
| 19:18, 23 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| dylanw Member Send a message Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 342 |
An alternative way of doing this is to get a London Midland Super Off-Peak return from Crewe to London (£20 each) together with a £21.10 off peak return from Preston to Crewe - total £41.10 return each. You could arrive on time (or even early) at London on the Saturday and Preston on the Sunday by leaving the starting points earlier than you would on Virgin (remember the London-Crewe portion is only valid on London Midland). It's not the most simple way of doing it for those not in the know but most people on this forum shouldn't have any problems! | |||
| 19:19, 23 September 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| dylanw Member Send a message Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 342 |
I'd like to add my 10 pence return from Birmingham New Street to London Euston on Virgin earlier this year to that list! | |||
| 16:20, 14 November 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| 33023 Member Send a message Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 725 |
Now that surely has to be a promotional price and not a normal rail fare.
I must be looking at a different train journey database, because as far as I am concerned most of those fares don't exist. Maybe as special promotions, but otherwise no. If those fares do exist, they are rarer than fleas on a mountain top. It's not so much I don't believe you, but in all the years I have been checking ticket prices, I've seen very few ticket prices that competitive. = Regarding train ticket prices in general. They are getting ridiculously high here, what with the Network Railcard having a minimum fare of £13 during the week, amongst other things. It seems that FCC and ATOC are on a mission to reduce the usefulness of the NR as much as possible. Did you know that all world rail speed records are set on the Heart of Wales line? This is a little known fact! Well done to SNCF (TGV). | |||
| 01:52, 15 November 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| Bedpan Member
Send a message Joined: Jul 2005 Posts: 685 |
As an example, here is the text of an e-mail I received from National Express East Coast on on 6.5.09, cut and pasted, which I used to buy tickets from Stevenage to Inverness and back for £18. There has been another one within the last month or so, it included Edinburgh but I don't know about Inverness as I didn't use it. "A summer treat. Train travel from £9* one way. We’re thrilled to announce we’re extending this fantastic offer until 7 May. You may have had trouble booking over the weekend, but there are still lots of tickets up for grabs. Book at nationalexpress.com/9 between 1 and 7 May inclusive. Travel between 1 June and 26 July inclusive. Don't forget to print off your voucher too! For the price of a few ice-creams that will melt in moments, National Express is offering you the chance to travel almost anywhere on the East Coast route for just £9 one way. Visit cities like London, York, Leeds, Newcastle and Edinburgh or explore the beautiful coastline and treat yourself to the best the British summer has to offer. *Fare is one way, Standard Class and subject to availability (with very limited availability 2-5 July 2009 for journeys to/from Scotland). Offer exclusive to bookings at nationalexpress.com/9 and is for travel on National Express East Coast trains only. Book by 7 May 2009. No other discounts, including Railcards or 10% online discount, can be applied. Train tickets only valid when presented with the printable voucher". Then on 15.10 I received another:- Book by 19 October for travel between 2 November and 17 December 2009 Like a great show that just keeps on running, this offer is back. You can travel to some of the most popular cities and towns on a ticket that starts at just £6* one way. Fancy a bit of early Christmas shopping... maybe ice-skating on an open-air city rink... or dropping in on friends. Whatever your reason for travelling, book by 19 October for travel between 2 November and 17 December and take advantage of these great one-way prices: Travel across one zone – tickets from £6* Travel across two zones – tickets from £9* Travel across three zones – tickets from £12* Travel across four zones – tickets from £15*" (The zone boundaries were Peterborough, York and Newcastle, so London - Edinburgh was £15 on that one). These were two examples, NXEC were sending them regularly. The £8 Hemel to Smethwick trip was booked on the London Midland website (or may have been National Rail) for example, if you book on the 11.27 or 13.27 from Hemel on 1.12.09, including overtaken trains in the results, the fare shows as £7.50. NB this ticket is valid on London Midland only, not valid on Virgin Trains. As for the Virgin trips in January, yes, they were more of a one off. I agree with you about the Network card though. On one hand I went to Charlton today from Harpenden for £8.25, on the other hand I ended up being back to St Pancras at 16.40 on Thursday so travelled on a slow train to Elstree at around 16.55 with no more than 12 of the 28 seats in my bay occupied (so where is the overcrowding on the slow trains?), then had to get off, buy a single to Harpenden and continue on the next train, equally empty despite the industrial dispute. Visit http://bedpan.fotopic.net. | |||
| 06:14, 15 November 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| 33023 Member Send a message Joined: Feb 2004 Posts: 725 |
Thank you for that information. Milton Keynes to Kidderminster is £5 each way on that day at the moment and easily available in just a few days advance as well. I'm just reaching for my oxygen mask. That is a journey I used to make fairly regularly and at the time Silverlink fares were cheaper than Virgin, but not that much cheaper. Add to that having to change at Northampton, it was less hassle to travel by Virgin at the time, due to WCML modernisation. The other thing of course is the cost of walk on fares, which is a problem because it is difficult for me to plan very far in advance. FCC don't seem to sell any off peak advance tickets. Personally, I think that is a missed opportunity to put more bums on seats, on trains which are often carrying around a lot of air, especially as most are now 8 carriages in length. Also, note to self. Sign up to the NXEC website. Did you know that all world rail speed records are set on the Heart of Wales line? This is a little known fact! Well done to SNCF (TGV). Number of edits: 1. Last edit: 06:17, 15 November 2009 | |||
| 11:16, 15 November 2009: | Report | Quote | |||
| dylanw Member Send a message Joined: Mar 2007 Posts: 342 |
Of course it was but it highlights the fact that to get the best fares you ALWAYS have to be on the lookout for offers and advance fares. The thing that winds me up about these price comparisons (and this isn't levelled at the opening poster as I realise that you are not guilty of doing this here) is the fact that the most flexible rail fare (i.e. an open ticket) is often compared to a coach or air fare which can only be used on one particular service and must be booked months in advance - the tabloids and freesheets are often guilty of doing this! Number of edits: 1. Last edit: 11:16, 15 November 2009 | |||